Did Jann Wenner EVER Interview Women?
Plus: Winners, Meetups, and Noteworthy News
In this issue:
Did Jann Wenner EVER Interview Women? I did some research…
National Coloring Day Contest: The Winner Is…
If #MeToo Happens To You
Noteworthy News: Olivia Rodrigo, Recording Academy Scholarship, Maren Morris
Did Jann Wenner EVER Interview Women?
“There are certain shades of limelight that can wreck a girl’s complexion.” — Holly Golightly, Breakfast At Tiffany’s
The music industry is buzzing about Rolling Stone Magazine founder Jann Wenner’s recent interview about his upcoming book The Masters: Conversations with Bono, Dylan, Garcia, Lennon, Springsteen, Townshend from Hachette Book Group. It’s getting him a lot of attention, but the limelight is doing him no favors.
Since the New York Times published Wenner’s interview with David Marchese, the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame (which Wenner cofounded) removed him from the board of directors, and the Montclair Literary Festival cancelled his upcoming appearance. Research shows: there’s a story behind the story.
The Headlines
Before we jump in, read these articles for his controversial comments and the book, release date set for September 26, 2023:
Hollywood Reporter (covers a lot of the NYT subscriber-only interview)
No one can argue with the fact that the featured artist interviews (reprinted from Rolling Stone Magazine) are rock and roll icons: Dylan, Lennon, Jagger, Townsend, Garcia, Bono, Springsteen. The book’s promotional description states, “The Masters intimately profiles the extraordinary musicians who dominated rock and roll, from London and California to New York and L.A.. This is a primary source, cultural masterpiece, and must-have volume about the artists who changed history."
The Interview
Here’s where things get sticky for Wenner in the interview. First, Wenner admitted that interview subjects, whom he calls friends, had access to and edited transcripts pre-publication. Not a problem for a book of chats with friends. But it’s another thing when the interviews first appeared in Rolling Stone Magazine. As an “all the news that fits” publication, this goes against journalistic standards.
Second, Wenner explains his artist choices in terms that smacked of discrimination. When asked about his choice of all-white men as “the artists who changed history,” Wenner’s reasoning translated to a) women are not articulate on an intelligent or philosophical level, and b) black musicians don’t fit his rock and roll zeitgeist.
Ouch.
Philosophical question: When does self-identifying with a specific group (Boomer white men in this case) cross the line into discrimination?
Discrimination?
I turned to Substack star Justin Foster, a branding expert who helps CEOs use their status and brand to create systemic change. He’s also a hell of a writer, so please follow him!
Here’s what Justin has to say:
“‘Boomer white men’ is a social label identified with power structures - especially patriarchy and white supremacy. Self-identifying with this group promotes the myth of meritocracy - where everyone has equal opportunity to succeed. Identifying with this group does not necessarily mean you support patriarchy or white supremacy, but it does ignore their systemic influence and existence.”
My interpretation: It’s fair enough that Wenner most relates to and spotlights the music and artists who reflect his experiences as a white man. That said, this is another example of biases exerting an insular, systemic influence on music history. Marketing the book’s curation as a “primary source, cultural masterpiece” of the ‘60s, ‘70s, and ‘80s rock era is a fantastical claim at best and historically white washed and gender biased at worst.
Music fans shouldn’t be surprised given Wenner’s editorial history with Rolling Stone’s famous cover itself. Here is a gender/color breakdown of acts appearing on Rolling Stone’s U.S. cover from the 1960s to 1980s.
Note: If individual acts or personalities appeared for a group shot, each person is accounted for separately. If a mixed race/gender band appeared, it is categorized one time based on the band leader or majority. Men of Color and Women of Color includes non-caucasian artists. Issues featuring fictional or non-personality specific features were not counted. Apologies to the Incredible Hulk.
If you consider the people Wenner mentions on The Masters book cover, here is a breakdown of how many times each man (solo or his band) appeared on Rolling Stone’s cover between 1967 and 1989:
Bob Dylan - 13
John Lennon - 18
Mick Jagger - 16
Pete Townsend - 9
Jerry Garcia - 8
Bono - 6
Bruce Springsteen - 10
During this era, Tina Turner appeared 7 times, Linda Ronstadt appeared 6 times, and Janis Joplin appeared 4 times. Yes, I’m focusing on the women because promoting gender equity in music is my jam.
Watch this interview with Tina Turner.
Watch this interview with Linda Ronstadt.
Notice how their conversations speak to good and not-so-good sides of the industry from the female perspective. Both are philosophical, articulate, and honest at the risk of causing discomfort.
The Story Behind The Story
According to the 67 “author” listings on RollingStone.com, Wenner never interviewed Turner or Ronstadt or Joplin as featured artists. He directly berates Joni Mitchell and Grace Slick in his NYT comments, sarcastically inviting you to “go have a deep conversation” with them. “Be my guest,” he adds. I cannot find Rolling Stone interviews with Mitchell or Slick by Wenner or his pseudonymous John J. Rock. In fact, I cannot find Wenner interviews featuring any female artist for the magazine during those decades. Did he EVER interview a woman, white or of color, as a feature?
It’s possible that said interview transcripts don’t have a byline or are sitting in a dusty box, once considered unworthy of publication. It’s possible… In that case, they would make a fantastic sequel to The Masters, and I publicly apologize to Wenner right here and now.
I will say thank God for journalists like Ben Fong-Torres and Cameron Crowe who did interview women during Wenner’s zeitgeist era. Wenner had the good editorial sense to include them in RS.
Lesson Learned
The scandal could have been avoided if Wenner answered Marchese’s NYT interview questions by confessing, “Hey, I regret not personally interviewing diverse iconic contributors to rock and roll. They would have made great additions.” It exemplifies his historical sexist approach to music journalism, but it’s better than insulting women’s intelligence.
Or, he and the publisher (who should have anticipated this PR crisis) could have marketed the book’s content as “a collection of my favorite conversations with kick-ass dudes in rock and roll.” No harm, no foul.
Rolling Stone is the reason I wanted to become a music journalist — after all, I grew up a Gen X, white, suburban, middle-class rock and roll fan. And Wenner’s enormous impact on modern music through the magazine, his books, and the Rock and Roll HoF is undeniable.
My calling is to ensure women’s stories and merit-based contributions to music history are documented. That is the inspiration for writing/illustrating my upcoming activity book First Ladies of Music.
National Coloring Day Contest: And The Winner Is…
Congratulations to our coloring contest winner Tasha Devoll from Phoenix, AZ!
Thanks to the ColorScape App creators, Tasha will receive:
12 months of free ColorScape AI access to create custom coloring sheets of her own
50 markers set
50 colored pencils set
Did you download a coloring sheet? If so, you’re automatically entered to receive a 15% discount code for the upcoming First Ladies of Music: A Rockin’ Activity & Coloring Book.
Childress Ink and Herizon Music are already planning a holiday coloring contest with cool art and music-related prizes. Can you guess the musical theme?
If #MeToo Happens To You
According to The Music Industry Research Association, 67% of women in the music have experienced sexual harassment. Some women say it’s inevitable the longer you are in the industry.
Sadly, that means that you or someone you know will need the advice and resources in your toolbox to handle the legal and emotional steps toward healing.
We are honored to welcome our November 6th Monday Meetup guest speaker: SIMS Foundation executive director Patsy Bouressa. Patsy has always been a vocal advocate for those dealing with mental health and substance use issues and has served on many committees and working groups dedicated to improving the way in which behavioral healthcare services are delivered.
Patsy will lead an open discussion with guests Patty Drew from The Wind and the Wave and Far From Saints and Courtney Santana, Singer/Songwriter and Founder/CEO of Survive 2 Thrive on dealing with #MeToo trauma and fielding your questions on this sensitive topic. Attendees will take home a list of resources to keep close at hand.
Join fellow female music makers in a safe and supportive environment with a complimentary lunch at a venue (TBA) in Austin, TX.
Seats will fill quickly, so please save the date and forward this info to other women — they do NOT have to be in the music industry to attend this event.
Not able to attend in person? Herizon Music will offer a livestream option for a nominal fee of $3. November 6th event details and tickets will be available shortly.
November 6th, 2023: SAVE THE DATE!
Noteworthy News
Olivia Rodrigo becomes first artist to chart all songs from two career-opening albums in the Hot 100’s top 40. (read more)
Karina Rykman’s release, Joyride climbed to No. 10 on the Billboard Alternative New Artist Albums Chart. (read more, podcast interview)
The Recording Academy’s Quinn Coleman Memorial Scholarship for black creators is accepting applications through October 6, 2023. (read more)
GRAMMY Award winner Maren Morris is leaving country music due to the genre being used as a "really toxic weapon in culture wars." (read more)
Please invite like-minded women and men to subscribe to this newsletter. Our goal is to reach 1,000 subscribers!
Thank you for joining our band of dreamers, rule breakers, and rockstars.
Thea 🎶
This article makes me wonder what “the face” of rock and roll would look like now if RS featured more women and POC in the ‘60s - ‘80s.
This is a wonderful breakdown of Wenner's problematic history. The chart is staggering. His comments aren't new and the years of going unchecked made his ego so huge that these consequences won't be enough. The book will make him money. His legacy, in his mind, is still intact. He's literally out there telling people that he has the power to change the world. On his press tour, he said this: " I’m exuberant like Bono, and we’re gonna save the world tomorrow. I’m like deep, thoughtful Bruce, and we’re gonna save the world tomorrow. And with Mick, we’re gonna go out dancing."
Thank you for doing the work of amplifying the voices of women.